New BVB players
January 7th, 20092. Who dissapointed you the most so fare?
Frei? Valdez? Pineer?
P.S: tricky question of course :p (ex: Frei should have scored more goals but did a lot of assists... Valdez: how much again? Pineer, a great midfielder?)
He had Barbarez to take some of the heat off him last season. This season, when he has played, he hasn't been nearly as effective because teams can gear their games toward stopping him.
Would be the same in Dortmund.
although VdV is injury prone, i would welcome him and his 20 games/season with open arms - we havent had a goal-scoring MF in quite some time....(since Andy Moeller - maybe)
Good point. I mean, he did have the same number of goals as Valdez last season! LOL!!
Actually, I think we have a goal-scoring midfielder not as good as vdV already on the roster, but BvM just didn't utilize him properly.
Pienaar.
He did have some nice scenes at the beginning of the season and against Bayer.......
Besides, we can't afford vdV and he isn't going to join Borussia Dortmund. If he decides to leave HSV and stay in Germany, you can bet your house he'll be headed to FC Bayern Muenchen.
However, I think if vdV leaves HSV, he's headed to Spain or Italy. He didn't join HSV to stay there. The Bundesliga is just a stepping-stone for him to bigger and better things.
Pienaar and Buckley seem to be suffering from the same disease
Pienaar at least shows some signs of life. He was only denied last week by a fantastic save from Hans-Joerg Butt........
btw - Buckley is on a express train for an exit from European football - he's been god awful for Basel
I've heard the same thing. But, I don't regret BVB taking a chance on him. How often do you get a shot at a guy who scored 15 goals the season before for 425,000 Euros??
BVB had to take that chance.
Kringe and Amedick
2. Who dissapointed you the most so fare?
Old Players : KRINGE
New Players : Pienaar
Frei and Valdez at least fight their asses off
.....HSV collectively has been struggling - VdV - mired with injuries again, coupled with his lack of rest from WC play(which seems to be one of the least discussed issues in the press - poor forms of Bayern and Milan for example) certainly has not helped.....
I think that "lack of rest from the WC" excuse is BS from the press.
Klose was at the WC and he's playing World Class football in the BL.
It's not holding back Frings either.
Sagnol, Lahm and Schweinsteiger are playing freakin' well for Bayern. All three were at the WC.
Bayern's problem is that they miss Michael Ballack in midfield. When the team needed a lift, Ballack was usually there with that timely pass or timely goal.
They don't have that anymore. That has been their major problem and honest Bayern fans acknowledge that now. Bayern themselves acknowledge it without saying it by announcing that they are looking for an offensive midfielder during this winter break.
Bayern RARELY goes into the winter transfer market.
Man U. had a few players at the WC too and they don't see to be any worse for wear. So did Inter.
AC Milan? Their strikers have forgotten how to put the ball in the net. It's not like Inter didn't have any WC participants and they are kicking ass.
Man, that WC rest stuff is just a crappy excuse for guys not getting the job done.
also - Trochowski did a nice job in VdV's absence (poor man's version of Borowski playing for Germany's NT as a substitute for Ballack) - this season - Trochowski seems like a lost child in a forest when he's on the pitch....
Kompany and De Jong (whom I lobbied for to come to BVB) their injuries have also been devestating.....
before the season - I had HSV penned as champions - their team was so solid on paper.....such is sport!
You know, you and I could team up on de Jong. You should see guys over at the Bayern forum trying to say he's crap. One guy even tried to blame the HSV downfall on de Jong.
I had to let them know that before de Jong got hurt, he was HSV's highest rated midfielder and it was de Jong who put that HSV team on his shoulders and took the to the CL when all looked lost in Osasuna.
I also think HSV totally went to crap after de Jong got hurt.
I also agree on Kompany, but the one injured player I feel HSV really miss who people don't talk about enough is Guy Demel.
They really miss his toughness in front of defense or out on the wing. That's one young player who BVB really PISSED ME OFF by letting go.
Of all the players we let go when BvM came on board, Demel is the one I felt we should have kept.
But I think the story was he did not wish to take a pay cut to remain in Dortmund.
As far as penning someone in as champions before the season, I had Bremen. I didn't think Bayern did a good enough job of replacing Ballack, I thought HSV would need Doll to actually coach this season and I didn't think he could. That's been correct so far, but I didn't think it would be THIS BAD.
The only other team I thought could contend is Schalke, but I'd never pick them for obvious reasons..... ;)
at the end i should say the truth
your words changed my mind about the bvb striker
they should work harder and scoooooore
thansk for this useful discussion
:cool:
Dude, they WORK hard enough, they just need to be cool in front of the net. That is their major problem.
i am dissaopinted about pienar and also tinga, i dont think that these two players from the quailty of bvb players, the club need more effeciency players in middlfield.
frei did well till now
valdez is unliky :(
that all
Martin Amedick. Very closely followed by Tinga.
2. Who dissapointed you the most so fare?
Frei? Valdez? Pineer?
P.S: tricky question of course :p (ex: Frei should have scored more goals but did a lot of assists... Valdez: how much again? Pineer, a great midfielder?)
Pienaar is my biggest disappointment among the new players, closely followed by Valdez.
My biggest disappointment overall right now is a guy who isn't playing all that badly in comparison to the rest, but he isn't giving the effort we're used to seeing from him.
That would be Dede........
Tinga has been one of the best players in this first round for us. I'd f#cking hate to see where we would be without him.[/QUOTE]
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i agree that tinga played better than pienaar andn some other players but what i was saying is ::: the quality of bvb players is less than it should>
[/QUOTE]Frei missed too many sitters. He should be pushing Klose and Pantelic for the league lead in goals. [/QUOTE]
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amoroso said once : i am scoring because rosicky playing.
so, there arent midillfield player who can provide the ball for frei as it should be. in my view , frei will be pushing kolse only when he have a middlefiled player same quality as diego.
BVB managment are way ahead of you. If Metzelder leaves, you can bet we will sign Bielefeld's Heiko Westermann.
Hell, we may get Westermann even if Metzelder stays.
i am dissaopinted about pienar and also tinga, i dont think that these two players from the quailty of bvb players, the club need more effeciency players in middlfield.
Pienaar, I definitely agree with, but what the heck has been "disappointing" about Tinga??
Tinga has been one of the best players in this first round for us. I'd f#cking hate to see where we would be without him.
Were it not for how Amedick came in and shored up our defense once BVB finally realized that Markus Brzenska SUCKS (As I said near the end of last season), I think we would be at least in the lower half of the table right now.
frei did well till now
Frei missed too many sitters. He should be pushing Klose and Pantelic for the league lead in goals.
Don't forget two of his five goals are converted penalties. He's on my "disappointment" list.
valdez is unliky :(
that all
I agree there, but he really didn't show any signs of coming out of it either.......
tinga the brazilian player is not what i am looking for in bvb, he is good at the moment , but i am looking for bright future.
You going to give the club the money it needs to do that?
Because they made a damned good deal to get a player as good as Tinga for the money they paid.
Best deal of the summer.
The club cannot spend money it does not have.
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frei is french league best scorer in 2004-05
And that means what? Name a French goal scoring champion other that Drogba to do anything outside of France?
Even Cisse had to take his sorry, broken ass back to France.
I have patience with Frei. "KubiNull" told us he might need a season or so.
But right now, the truth is the truth and he misses too many damned sitters.
and also valdez was one of the best bundesliga striker in the league with bremen
Who told you that bullshit??
He was tied for 23rd place with the likes of the guy who took his place on Bremen's bench, Mohammed Zidan, another guy I think who is currently on Bielefeld's bench in Ahanfouf and Benjamin Auer. Two other guys down there with him were van der Vaart and Barbarez.
Valdez was seen as one of the top "jokers" in the league. Or, a guy who can come off the bench and score goals for you.
BVB just assumed that would translate into more goals with regular play.
That hasn't happened.
This is why, yes, I wanted Valdez, but I also said, BVB paid way too much for him.
there are good strikers, i am sure you know the problem in middlefield and how you want from a striker to score without help from the middlefield, bvb dont has henry in the squad>
all strikers miss some easy scoring chances but how many scoring chances in bvb matches<< few.
Dude, what the heck are you talking about???!!!
Have you seen BVB this season or are you making this up as you go along??
I watch EVERY MATCH!! Some more than once!
Yes, we need help in central midfield. We need help there badly. But for you to come on here and say that is why Frei and Valdez are not scoring is just plain wrong.
That is a contributing factor, yes, but Frei has left enough sitters on the pitch to be among the league leaders in scoring! And that is not saying he should have made all of them!
If he makes a third of them, he's up around ten goals. Valdez is even worse right now!
Sure, they could use a creative midfielder. But that is not their major problem.
Their major problem is that they don't even convert the chances they get. And they get a hell of a lot more than you seem to think!
There hasn't been one match this season that I've seen where I could sit and say, "Damn, the midfield just didn't give them anything."
MOST matches, I could say, "They need more from midfield, but they are squandering most chances they do get!"
When one of them is open in front of net, I don't even prepare to cheer anymore. My mind is thinking, "How will he blow it this time?"
bayern has got van bommel, basti and they have problem in middlefield. they looking forward to buy middlefield player in winterbreak.
Exactly. But they are still scoring goals because they have guys like Pizarro and Makaay who know how to finish!
shcalke have slomka who knows how to use the players in most useful way.(they have good players)
They have good strikers. Their best creative midfielder, Lincoln (Who BVB wants and is Dede's best friend), has been out of the lineup for much of the first half of the season and for all of this winning run they are on.
They are the best proof that you don't need a "Diego" to score. You can create chances from the wings if you have effective strikers who know what to do with the ball in front of goal and who don't shit their pants when they get the ball there.
and i dont know too much about Stuttgart and Hertha Berlin. (sorry)
Stuttgart doesn't have any "playmaker" to speak of. They have effective strikers in Mario Gomez and Cacau and use their wingers and Roberto Hilbert to push the attack.
Hertha Berlin's "playmaker" Yildray Basturk has been out for much of the first half of the season, yet their strikers still score.
If your logic is correct, they should not be scoring at all.
But that is what happens when you have strikers who take advantage of the opportunities they do get.
You still score goals and you still win matches.
BVB has strikers who do not take advantage of the opportunities they do get.
And we don't score goals and the only reason we are not fighting relegation is because of luck and our solid defense.
i hope, after kehl return back with new coach, bvb will be in top 6>
That's a lot of hoping. It's going to take more than Juergen Roeber (Going to be introduced as the new coach in about 25 minutes) and Sebastian Kehl.
Yes, we need much better play from the midfield, but even more, we need Frei and Valdez to start living up to their expectations.
Especially Valdez.
at the end,, thanks for this discusing
I hope I was not too harsh with my words, but some of your reasoning here, I believe to be badly flawed........
Barbarez's late game efforts/goals certainly cannot be overlooked but
.....HSV collectively has been struggling - VdV - mired with injuries again, coupled with his lack of rest from WC play(which seems to be one of the least discussed issues in the press - poor forms of Bayern and Milan for example) certainly has not helped.....
also - Trochowski did a nice job in VdV's absence (poor man's version of Borowski playing for Germany's NT as a substitute for Ballack) - this season - Trochowski seems like a lost child in a forest when he's on the pitch....
Kompany and De Jong (whom I lobbied for to come to BVB) their injuries have also been devestating.....
before the season - I had HSV penned as champions - their team was so solid on paper.....such is sport!
Would be the same in Dortmund.
Good point. I mean, he did have the same number of goals as Valdez last season! LOL!!
However, I think if vdV leaves HSV, he's headed to Spain or Italy. He didn't join HSV to stay there. The Bundesliga is just a stepping-stone for him to bigger and better things.
Pienaar at least shows some signs of life. He was only denied last week by a fantastic save from Hans-Joerg Butt........
I've heard the same thing. But, I don't regret BVB taking a chance on him. How often do you get a shot at a guy who scored 15 goals the season before for 425,000 Euros??
BVB had to take that chance.
true....he was the best left winger in BL that season
and I also agree that VdV will never come to BVB.....although he has been quoted in the press that he is keen on staying in Hamburg - i doubt it - I will be actually surprised to see him staying in BL - if Barca parts ways with Giuly - VdV will be sprinting out of Hamburg with shoes untied
at the end i should say the truth
your words changed my mind about the bvb striker
they should work harder and scoooooore
thansk for this useful discussion
:cool:
i am dissaopinted about pienar and also tinga, i dont think that these two players from the quailty of bvb players, the club need more effeciency players in middlfield.
frei did well till now
valdez is unliky :(
that all
And I want to see less bandwagon fans to bvb ... geez some would say ... 5 years of playing crap is enough to get the dreamers run :)
Although I would like VdV myself ... but only because I like his attitude (he is the only HSV player besides rheinhardt who fights)
Tinga has been one of the best players in this first round for us. I'd f#cking hate to see where we would be without him.
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i agree that tinga played better than pienaar andn some other players but what i was saying is ::: the quality of bvb players is less than it should
And how do you figure that??
BVB doesn't have enough money to buy world-class players.
Tinga was one of the best at his position in the entire league.
Frei missed too many sitters. He should be pushing Klose and Pantelic for the league lead in goals.
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amoroso said once : i am scoring because rosicky playing. so, there arent midillfield player who can provide the ball for frei as it should be. in my view , frei will be pushing kolse only when he have a middlefiled player same quality as diego.
Spoken like someone who hasn't really seen the team play.
Just because the team doesn't have a "midfield maestro" doesn't automatically mean that's the reason they are not scoring.
Sure, it's a factor, but both Frei and Valdez left too many chances laying on the pitch this first round of the season.
Chances cooler strikers would have put away.
Bayern doesn't have a Diego either, but they still find ways to score. Same with Schalke, Stuttgart and Hertha Berlin.
What they do have is strikers who know how to take advantage of the chances they do get.
I think that was a really bad assumption on your part man.
i am dissaopinted about pienar and also tinga, i dont think that these two players from the quailty of bvb players, the club need more effeciency players in middlfield.
frei did well till now
valdez is unliky :(
that all
I am a huge fan of van der vaart - i think he's an amazing footballer when healthy - last year HSV was virtually unbeatable with him in lineup -
although VdV is injury prone, i would welcome him and his 20 games/season with open arms - we havent had a goal-scoring MF in quite some time....(since Andy Moeller - maybe)
Pienaar and Buckley seem to be suffering from the same disease
btw - Buckley is on a express train for an exit from European football - he's been god awful for Basel
Tinga has been one of the best players in this first round for us. I'd f#cking hate to see where we would be without him.[/QUOTE]
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i agree that tinga played better than pienaar andn some other players but what i was saying is ::: the quality of bvb players is less than it should>
[/QUOTE]Frei missed too many sitters. He should be pushing Klose and Pantelic for the league lead in goals. [/QUOTE]
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amoroso said once : i am scoring because rosicky playing.
so, there arent midillfield player who can provide the ball for frei as it should be. in my view , frei will be pushing kolse only when he have a middlefiled player same quality as diego.[/QUOTE]
Lol You are ... a hell of a BVB fan .... YOU ONLY CARE FOR PLAYERS WHO RUIN THE CLUB ..... (and I don't mean sportslike)
Tinga is what a true BVB Fan wants to see ... A GUY WHO ********ING FIGHTS HIS ASS OFF ... and not a ********ing whining diva!!
Don't think his current Turkish team would sell him at a price we can afford.
And how do you figure that??
BVB doesn't have enough money to buy world-class players.
Tinga was one of the best at his position in the entire league.
if the club want to be in top 3, they should spent some money.
tinga the brazilian player is not what i am looking for in bvb, he is good at the moment , but i am looking for bright future.
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Spoken like someone who hasn't really seen the team play.
Just because the team doesn't have a "midfield maestro" doesn't automatically mean that's the reason they are not scoring.
Sure, it's a factor, but both Frei and Valdez left too many chances laying on the pitch this first round of the season.
Chances cooler strikers would have put away.
Bayern doesn't have a Diego either, but they still find ways to score. Same with Schalke, Stuttgart and Hertha Berlin.
What they do have is strikers who know how to take advantage of the chances they do get.
I think that was a really bad assumption on your part man.
frei is french league best scorer in 2004-05, and also valdez was one of the best bundesliga striker in the league with bremen,,
there are good strikers, i am sure you know the problem in middlefield and how you want from a striker to score without help from the middlefield, bvb dont has henry in the squad>
all strikers miss some easy scoring chances but how many scoring chances in bvb matches<< few.
bayern has got van bommel, basti and they have problem in middlefield. they looking forward to buy middlefield player in winterbreak.
shcalke have slomka who knows how to use the players in most useful way.(they have good players)
and i dont know too much about Stuttgart and Hertha Berlin. (sorry)
i hope, after kehl return back with new coach, bvb will be in top 6>
at the end,, thanks for this discusing
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